Ok Ive been getting quite a few pms the past several days on this so I decided to just lay out the foundation here. First off much of what I've done was through experience, common sense, and of course, using information from others.

Let me toot my own horn here for one second. Ive been doing DNP since like 97 or 98 and ive tried just about every approach out there. Ive tried different ideas, tested some theories via emails through Dan Duchaine, who actually may have been THE first to combine DNP with a CKD, and mainly as a tool to deplete glycogen, and let me tell you, it is more profound than going through a high rep circuit training.

Ive caught ideas from Lyle and Par on leptin around in 2000 and help me answer which NO ONE else noticed why people got fatter after a few weeks once ceasing DNP. Ive posted ideas on Elite around 2001 or so only to later learn that I was banned and have Fonz steal my ideas (and some of the stuff he wrote is not optimal) to write his own DNP Inferno column.

Let me get straight to the point. Ive been doing something similar to a DNP+UD2.0 for just about 2 years now, yes, that was way before even the book came out. Ive debated with Lyle (not really a debate, exchange of ideas-miscommunication)

I do this when I need to drop several pounds of bodyfat very quickly while gaining muscle, at worst maintaining it. Basically a few years ago I got sick and tired of feeling like shit for a week and was looking for some good fat loss without the ultra sweaty-feel like shit feeling.

Here is the plan of what I do. Loki is crazy smart so would like to see his other enhanced ideas. I am a minimalast when it comes to this, but there are ways to enhance fat loss, gain muscle. Here is my plan.

Low Cal-Low carb days: (be sure to do 1200mg of NAC and other antioxes as well)

Mon: Ive tried doing very low doses of DNP (100mg-200mg) but feel it is not worth my time. So what I do is raise DNP dosages to about 400mg (even a good amount higher than that since Ive got soooo much experience with this). I take 400mg with some high dose EC just to fight hunger and lethargy. I take all of this in the morning.

Tues: Same thing, take your DNP dosage all in the morning since we want to clear as much of the bug poison as we can prior to the tension workout.

Wed: No DNP, keep doing the EC stack. Maybe a little cardio but I don't do much besides staying a bit active.

Thurs: By this time, MOST of the DNP should be out of your system. Of course, you may still have some trace amounts, enough to give you an 'extra' sweat during a workout. Now you know the rest of what to do here as laid in the book with workouts, refeeds, and 'extras' you can do.

What results I got plenty of bodyfat loss with gains in muscle, especially when extras are tossed in there. Usually in the end my bodyweight stays pretty much the same which is just damn cool.

That is all, nothing extraordinary. You can throw in fibratets which I do and even Leptigen when you get to your leaner stage. I do throw in t3 even though it may not be 'needed' for that short time frame.

Thanks to spook, lyle, and dan duchaine.

By the way, nothing huge but I guess using Avant's products which I assume many have, I would do this:

Low carb days: Ab Solved, or even Capsazacin (or however you spell it) applied whole body. Ouch? Yes. Profound? YES!!
Lipoderm I guess as well, especially towards leaner state.
Sesathin and HEAT.

Basic when one is under set point or towards lean, rebirth for you fatties.

High Carb days: Mass for sure. Maybe a touch of rebirth to increase signalling.

again, nothing groundbreaking and i think most of you knew this, kinda, already.

Nice post, Mr Q...I dunno if I'm crazy enough yet to try DNP, but I'm sure many here and at lyle's board will appreciate this.

Great info-- nice to have someone crazy enough to try this kinda stuff
Could quick questions:
1. What do you do for day 1/2 workouts?
2. Would DNP on sunday night to be a good idea?

Yeah Fuzz, no problem. DNP is crazy but not crazy if you know what you are doing and you take extra precautions. For example I find that buying caps from someone else is a terrible idea, not only do you pay WAY more than buying in high gram/kg quantities, but you get to know how much you are taking.
Best way to start is low and slow. My fear of DNP is long-term effects, its effects on free radicals, etc.

Fornero

1. For the half day, I would just do the high dose EC stack and hope and pray that the DNP clears the system on time. Of course, it may not be like that 100% of the time (where I extend another diet day since I know metabolism is still pumpin'). Id take a prohormone like 1-AD preworkout, drink some gatorade creatine mix during, followed by usual post workout shake. More 1-AD of course.

I would reccomend M1-T simply because it is cheap, but since I can afford it, I do high dose 1-AD on the night of tension workout and carbload day. I think high dose 1-AD for 1 day or 1-1/2 day is fantastic in terms of optimal repartioning. This is pretty much a guarantee that you won't gain fat on the weekend if yor are a little sloppy.

Another thing worth mentioning is that strength durning tension and power workouts is random like the wheel of fortune. Sometimes you come in stronger, other times weaker, and others the same. After two weeks once ceasing DNP, you will notice that your strength goes up pretty well.

2. DNP Sunday night is a good idea though I don't really do it simply because my recovery is not that great (which is why I love 1-AD during weekend since DNP tends to leave you more sore than usual).
The advantages of Sunday night DNP is that you get more depletion by the time Monday is ready and your body is set to go in terms of high fat loss. It is more personal why I dont usually do the SUnday night thing, but you should get a bit more fat loss.

By the way, I cant prove it and may be wrong, but another great idea of doing DNP in short cycles like 2 days is that when you come off is that your metabolism is not as hurt as say doing 8-10 day DNP cycles.

Also, I forgot to mention, I dont do DNP every week. SOmetimes I'll do a 3 on, 1 off, 2 on-1 off, etc.

And more thing worth mentioning. I usually do 600mg on Monday, and say 400mg Tuesday. Should get your body cookin' up until tension workout. And I have tried doing DNP on Wednesday early morning and do tension the next night, but Ive noticed wayy to much sweats during carb load, meaning I didnt give body enough time to be in its optimal anabolic phase

Sorry, let me reword:

What workouts would you do on day 1 and day 2? Do you do anything for glycogen depletion, or do you feel that DNP does most/all of the work?


I've used both M1T and 1-AD on the carb loads (this is without DNP), and definately liked the high (~900mg/day) dose 1-AD better. I think I'll try bumping up the M1T dose a bit (been using 15mg) and see how it treats me, or perhaps try out BSL's 1-TU.

Fornero, yeah, miscommunication on my part. You meant days 1 and 2, I thought it was a half (1/2) and thought it was the weird half day.

Workouts as far as weight training goes is either none to just light depletion work. Basically 2 sets per bodypart, in the 12-15 range at around 60% max. In other words pretty much what the UD2.0 requires but much less sets. Staying active like walking more, shooting some hoops, tossing a football, etc.

That is a strange coincedence since I thought M1-T would way outperform the 1-AD. Turns out I get near to perfect carb ups doing 1g of 1-AD on Friday, half a gram on Thursday night. My dosage on M1-T was 20mg.

I also come out a tad bit stronger on the 1-AD, with much less bloat than M1-T. Id still opt for M1-T due to its very cheap price especially in comparison to 1-AD, though as I said before, I can afford it and had better experiences with 1-AD.

Here is another tip I just discovered recently
One is that CapZ on chest, abs, love handles and arms is a bit painful and does exaggerate the DNP sweats (and the whole point is to get good fat loss without feeling like shit, but I still wanted to try) and works wonders.

But the latest discovery is that I tend to get hot after my workout, or even after doing some moderate cardio. So basically I head down to 7-11 and get a medium sized diet slurpee, and I believe that it contains a good amount of glycerin which is helpful on DNP.

Most of all though, it helps keep you cool for a bit especially when the heat starts to build. Plus it is tasty so another plus.

I've been a little disappointed with the M1T as well. 1.5g of 1-AD over the two days worked amazingly well for me, but I haven't been able to get quite the same results with M1T. Might be a dosing issue though, as ~1g/day is pretty damn high on 1-AD, comapred to ~20mg of M1T.

Have you tried going higher on M1T during carb-load? I'm gonna give ~25mg a shot today. Much as I liked 1-AD, I can't argue with $10/bottle

I personally preferred to just take 800mg of DNP all on Monday, spread out over the course of the day (I also took another 200mg Sunday nights) when I tried this for a few weeks a little while back, but MrQ. is right, the technique is pretty fucking effective, especially when using something like 17aa-1-Test or Methyldien throughout...

I would imagine cycling the three Leptigens on/off throughout it (along with Sesathin & whatever other shit you're into) would enhance results significantly on both ends of the spectrum as well...

I wonder if increasing my dex dosage during a run of DNP would outweigh the potential problems I imagine could arise.

Fornero the most M1-T Ive ever used was 20mg in a single day. Despite me sounding like the opposite of a health advocate, Im still unsure on the uses, dosages of M1-T where I feel comfortable enough to use, such as blood pressure-liver, etc.

I mean with DNP there is DEATH, of course, knowing what dosage you can handle and tossing things like NAC, Vitties C and E, etc, can help keep the free radical damage down somewhat.

With 1-AD, I dont feel as lethargic, get better pumps, get better consistency with strength gains. Plus, if Im a betting man, Im willing to bet that higher M1-T dosages such as 20+ mgs is more suppresive than pushing 1g of 1-AD. Could be wrong though.

Loki, yes, this plan is very effective. I like your scheme with doing it all on one day or even the night before includes to get things started. Only times Ive done once a day dosage was merely a time issue.

Prolang, let us know how it goes

Whats Up MR Q,
Nice to see you posting..

U still in Costa Rica? I just got back from CR.. Nice!

In your experience does most of the fat loss come in the first few days? It seems that way with me. My first cycle, I started at 200 for 4 days then to 600 for the last 3 days and it seemed that the first 3 day were the most optimal.

Does the body build-up a tolerance after 3 or 4 days?

I've been on DNP the last week, This time I started a 'blast' on Thursday at 400, Friday at 800, Saturday 600, Sunday 0, now back to 200 Monday-Thurs.. I'll probably cease on Friday...I tried this for the reason of a possible tolerance build-up after the first few days and so I can function at work.

BTW that was my first time at 800.. So much different than 600 mgs. I went outside for 15 minutes and thought I ran the boston marathon. Went and took a cold bath and was still sweating profusely.. Chugged some Pineapple juice and then felt a lot better.

HammerAbby, I was in Costa Rica, but checked out Panama (sucked, pricy, and ugly girls, though was there for a business deal that quite didnt fall through) and recently Colombia (being dangereous is quite hyped, well, that is if you don't know what you are doing sorta like DNP;))

Ill get to your q's later tonite, but just found out that I got the ok to hit an article on this, since there is more shit I want to cover.

Update:

Sorry for not getting the article, but talked with mindandmuscle and now it will be done. Just sending final word to Loki if I can get dibs on it but still would like to get some input one way or the other. If he wants to do it fully than no problemo.

Expect a 2 or 3 part series (unless someone wants me to through up a simple how to guide, but I think everyone wants details, FAQ section, all that good shit)....trust me everyone, this is serious body recomposition at its best, probably doesnt get much better and will be surprised if there isnt 100% satisfied results. And no PCT required.

Don't get me wrong. I myself think DNP CAN be an extremely safe highly effective drug. Furthermore I may even advocate its usage BUT not on a large scale.



A very real fear. Therefore, I don't think it's in anyone's best interest to post guides such as this. Too many people read boards like this who are far too reckless. It's only a matter of time before something happens. Especially when it's being advised to use DNP weekly for many weeks in a row. No one knows what the long term effects are.

Moreover, there is definately a short term fear involved as well. All it would take would be for some fool to have a few drinks, use a diruretic, misdose, give too large a dose to a friend, etc, etc.....and we would have a major problem. This is not at all a stretch if you realize the studipidity of the majority of people.

Tread lightly.

although you don't cocour I know Dsade and others have used very low dose DNP with success/ myabe you could also hae a part on that aspect?

Then again, in the grand scheme of things, if it's a few weeks on DNP vs. a few months on some absurd cocktail of daily stimulants, vasoconstrictors, and lord knows what else...

Gus, I have actually thought about taht too and even brought up that discussion several times in different forums. Meaning, treading the 'unknown' when it comes to DNP and free radicals in the long term. There are no studies that Im aware of that actually shows the indirect effect of DNP producing free radicals (though in-vitro I believe the ultimate guru in FR research "Audrey G"...cant exactly remember his name though I did email him at times and passed info to Elzi, in-vitro shows decrease in FR) and how much they are reduced via supps/drugs like NAC, Vittie E, etc. Are they reduced significantly enough or is it simply putting a basic band-aid on a bullet wound?

The only conclusion I came was just common sense and some risk (which may not be the smartest choice on my part). The lower the dosage the lower the FR, which therefore increases chance of anti-ox doing their part to hopefully wipeout a good portion of FR. Higher dosage may be too high in FR for things like NAC to do anything significant, of course, do take them for insurance.

There are many issues to also take into consideration, like the amount of FR produced from basic exercise and dieting (weight training, cardio). If exercise produced X amount of FR/lb of fat loss, will the same be done with DNP say with no training to achieve the same fat loss with a basic DNP free regimine?

And same goes with DNP dosage. Even though 5-6mg/kg of DNP will produce more FR compared to say 2-3mg/kg, one has to take DNP for a longer period to achieve the same fat loss with say the higher dose. Now Im guessing that it may be better to go with the lower dosage (aside safety issues) even with the longer period of time frame since it probably increases the chance of the anti-ox to do their work to reducing FR damage. There may be a diminishing return with DNP, meaning just because one does double the amount of DNP doesnt equal double the FR. There may be 3 times the FR even though you double the dosage. Who knows.

We just end up back to square one and accept the risk if one is willing.

Gus, this is a good point and this is something that MRIs, blood work, etc may not be able to detect (unless there is a way) which ends up a question mark.

For short term, my stance is this...I will not short-change info to cautious, intelligent people because of some idiots. Almost sounds like the ban of PH. (although PH ban is a mixture of things, politcal, $$, power, im sure Rick C. has that covered as to the 'whys' on that issue) People need to learn to be responsible for themselves especially if say this guide will have warnings from all angles.

Even though it is easy to find 'anything' on the net just about, it does help that Avants target audience has triple the IQ than say your 'bro' fan base of Elite and the likes.

Exactly Loki. Big difference when doing a few short cycles of DNP in comparison to using it continuasly.

how about diet during the depletion phase? would it be the normal when on UD2? or would it be beneficial to eat some fruit to provide some energy?

Keep calories as low as possible without compromising your basic ability to function and exercise.

ok man, thanks alot. i didnt know if one was suppose to include fruit in the 50g carbs\day or if you would eat 50g carbs + some fruit+veggies

Bumping up an old post, that has developed some new interest. Could some of the new orals such as superdrol be used in short bursts on the weekends for the carbload? I know superdrol is harsh on the lipids but 2 days out of the week to help with glycogen compensation shouldn't be to bad with proper support supplements? I know superdrol is super effective at storing glycogen in the muscles, but I find it hard to believe that any oral such as 1ad, m1t, superdrol etc can be effect in such a short time period(2days). I would think 10mg of superdrol would be effective on Thursday afternoon and Friday morning if it did theoretically work though.

It is my opinion that you cannot use any orals like that without seriously screwing up your HPTA. When you're looking at a substance that completely shuts down T production [as measured by shrinking testicles] in 2-3 days (M1T) or 5-7 days (Superdrol), taking it for 1-2 days a week for a lengthy period of time is probably going to depress T very significantly on the other 5-6 days. It's possible you'd be doing more harm than good to your body comp.

I am sure 1-T does this to a much lesser extent, which is probably why it worked so nicely.

What about something like 4-ad over the weekend?

Make it a cyclodextrin IN complex and use it prior to workouts & meals if you want to minimize HPTA disruption, but oral 4-AD will likely not be a problem just as 1-T wasn't on 1-2 days of the week.

In my situation it doesn't really matter because im on HRT from inherently low testosterone levels. So would it be effective in short 2 day periods?

Bump. Just thought this was an interesting post.

Definitely Kimbo.

Is Prolangtum still around? If so, did he ever try dex with his DNP? Or, any issues with DNP and his BP crisis while on dex?