What protein drinks would you recommend I have either pre or post workout?
I am going to do an HST cycle, and was not sure
1) What drink to have
2) How often to have the drink (post workout only, pre and post workout)

I have not used a protein supplement in months, is it really necessary for muscle growth to have one?
The last drink I used regularly was this:

Cytosport Muscle Milk - 2.48 Lb
Specific information about this supplement. can be found here
Basically, it has Calories 348 (162 from fat) per serving (2 scoops)
Total Fat 18g
Protein 32g


Any good?

Just curious, I have very hard time getting enough protein for my nutritional needs on a regular basis.
I take it that for someone looking to improve muscle, I want 1.5(or is it 1?) gram of protein per weight?

Would it be a problem if I drank EVERYDAY 2 protein drinks to ensure I get enough protein regardless of whether I workout and 4 protein drinks when I do workout?

When do you train--morning, noon, or night?

http://www.blackstarlabs.com/?products_id=26

I don't know, that drink has 22 grams of sugar. Isn't that too much?
I don't want a McDonalds milkshake.

This is post-workout, so you need the sugar calories -- as long as they are the right sugar type.

What do you guys think of N-Large^2 as a workout protein?

N-Large 2 is not a good post workout out drink.

All you need post workout is a good whey protein isolate, 1-2 scoops
Dextrose (can be bought at bulknutrition, NOW brand) 1-2 scoops(same scoop size as your protein.)
This is all you really need to replenish muscle gylcogen, however, you may wish to also add 5 grams (1 teaspoon) of creatine as well, which would be even better yet. This is a great post workout shake my friend, these are the necessities.

Good whey protein isolates,
ErgoPharm GF Pro
Syntrax Nectar
Molecular Nutrition Whey Fruity (please don't support this company though, Bill is an ass)
Interactive Nutrition IsoWhey
Nature's Best Isopure

or you could simply opt to check out www.blackstarlabs.com and they will make your post workout blend for you, with your choice of ingredients (carb source, protein source, and flavor).
This is the easiest option, and they have excellent products/flavorings.

Keep us updated on which you choose/feedback.

Rick

Rick, thanks a lot for your help.

Which product on blackstarlabs would the best one for me to use?
Could you give me the name of the product or the link, I think I'd rather have this stuff premade.

I'm assuming that when ordering a protein supplement like this from blackstarlabs, that it comes in the same powder form as you buy in the stores?

Do I need to be taking this drink both pre and post workout, or do I not need any supplement pre workout?

Would this supplement be a good as well?
I have a very diffcult time getting enough protein consistently and having enough meals daily.
I was wondering if I should be having a protein shake like this as a meal 1-2 times everyday, even on workout days?

Thanks again, I really am hoping I can diet and supplement right so I don't waste HST work.

This is a good post workout drink,
http://www.blackstarlabs.com/?cPath=24&products_id=26

Or you might opt to custom design one. It's not difficult, the site is set up well.

IMO you would add
CFM whey protein isolate 60-70%
dextrose 30-40%
add any flavor of your choice
if you can afford it, fill any blank percentage with ImmunoGro.

You would then use this formula preferably only for post workout.

Yes it comes in a powder same/similar to stores.

If you need to add more protein to your diet and choose a protein supplement, a blend of fast/slower proteins would be more ideal. Say a 40% whey isolate
50% casein
10% egg

Of course these ratio's can be played around with according to your goals/needs.

If you need extra protein in your diet I strongly suggest using 1-4 protein shakes throughout the day, either on their own or with meals that are not protein rich (to increase that meals protein intake).

Your supplement regiment will get better with time. It takes some experimenting & learning what does/doesn't work well for you, when to take them, how much etc.

Be consistant and keep learning, you'll do just fine.

Rick

The product you linked looks like the real deal.
How many servings normally go into a single protein drink?

As I said, since I am not that experienced with supplements as I am with training, I think I want to go with a premade drink until I am more comfortable. If that's not a problem.

Is there any particular product at BlackStarLabs or GNC that would make a good protein drink to have daily as a meal?
I take from what you said and the description on BlackStarLabs that the post workout drink would not be good for a regular meal.

Do you take any protein drinks before you workout as a meal?

Before I train I just use a basic whey protein isolate (Syntrax's Nectar to be exact) and whatever I have scheduled to eat for the time frame before training. I usually eat about 1-1.5 hours before training.

There are alot of good options out there as far as protein is concerned. You could do similar to I, and have a whey protein isolate with a regular meal. Or once again you could utilize blackstarlabs cutom formula's (even better yet).

A good option would contain whey isolate, casein, egg, a low glycemic carb and possibly even a form of fiber. Hope that helps.

Rick

Would muscle milk also be a good pre workout and daily meal?

The high dietary fat intake and ingredients make Muscle Milk more of a MRP than a pre/post workout supplemental meal. It is important to have the high glycemic carbs postworkout to spike your insulin and replenish muscle glycogen.

- Fletch

That's what I thought. So muscle milk would work best as a daily meal.

Fletch, do you think a pre workout protein drink is necessary? Do I need to have both a pre and post workout drink, or is just a post workout drink fine?

What do you use as your pre or post workout drink?
Is it alright to use a post workout drink as a daily meal too?
I'd like to avoid costs by using 1 protein drink and not 2 to 3 total.

Protein shakes are more for convenience than anything else since a 35g serving of protein powder is almost half the cost of a can of tuna. I prefer whole food when I can as it keeps my stomach more satisfied and doesn't have me living out of a container of powder.

This is the protocol that I follow that I have read from Zepplin's Performance Eating article series that is found in a couple back issues of Mind & Muscle Magazine. (the Avant online magazine)

I eat a whole food meal around 90 minutes prior to training consisting of a protein source (eggs/lean beef/tuna/chicken/salmon/turkey/etc.) and a complex carb source (brown rice/low fat microwave popcorn/sweet potato/white potato/whole grain cereal/etc.)

During training, I sip on a mixture (Vendetta or custom blend) that is similar to gatorade w/ some aminos thrown in. (this would be optional)

Immediately following training when I get home I make myself a protein shake with carbs (dextrose,maltodextrin, fruit, oats, honey, etc.) and some whey protein powder. The nice thing about the "Anabolic Post Workout Formula" is that it is almost the identical ratios for my postworkout shake minus a piece of fruit or the oats. It is also almost identical to my drink I sip on during training, however my stomach doesn't handle a whole protein as well as aminos.

My best recommendation for you is to start by eating a whole food meal 90-100 minutes prior to when you train, and having a protein shake immediately afterwards.

- Fletch


It's a 2 part series found here
http://www.avantlabs.com/page.php?pageID=73&issueID=6

and here
http://www.avantlabs.com/page.php?pageID=78&issueID=7

Thanks Fletch. I think then as a trial for my 1st HST cycle, I'll have either eggs/tuna/chicken/even yogurt along with a bagel or something of that kind as my pre workout meal a full 90 minutes ahead of time.

Since I like to workout mid afternoon, would it be alright if my pre workout meal was lunch?

Other than a post workout protein drink, do you eat anything else after working out?
Sometimes I'll have my lunch afterwards, but if I going to be eating that 90 minutes before the workout I don't have that choice.
Is a protein drink post workout enough nourishment until the next meal 2-4 hours later?


I don't want to live out of power either!
No the reason I brought that up is because I am having a difficult time finding enough healthy meals and protein to eat each day.
On the days I do have tuna and those foods, I still have trouble consistently eating enough protein and non garbage food.
Therefore I was hoping that I could "ease" this problem by having a protein drink as a regular meal daily.
This would mean on non workout and workout days I would have the same 1 protein drink.
Is that a problem?

One last question, do you have the same number of meals on a non workout day as a workout day?
Can the post workout protein drink count as one of the 5 to 6 daily meals?
Thanks.

I know you asked specifically for Fletch's response/thoughts, however I though I'd chime in once again, hope you don't mind.

Muscle milk is a acceptable meal replacement first off. Second of all, a pre-workout drink is more luxury than necessity, while post workout drink is a necessity. Eating 60-90 minutes before training is a great idea, just remember to emphasize complex carbohydrates with a protein source as well. So if you are going to have a bagel, make sure it's whole wheat, which is a lower glycemic index than a regular white bagel. It is great if your pre workout meal is your lunch, because it makes it more convenient for yourself, and you'll be more likely to stick to your pre workout meal approach. After your post workout drink, you should be eating another whole meal once again, 60-90 minutes after. Emphasising complex carbs and lean protein, and if at all possible, should also contain some good fibrous vegetables as well. I encourage you to include a protein supplement to help you meet your requirements, the more convenient at this stage of your training, the more likely you are to keep meeting your macronutrient goals and requirements. A protein shake either with meals or as a subtitute for meals is a great idea, and you can do this as often as you feel necessary your meet your goals, 2-4 times per day is great. You should have the same amount of meals on non training days as well, and yes, your post workout shake CAN count as a meal, all depending on your specific goals etc. Some people do not consider post workout drinks as a meal, while other do, it really doesn't make a great difference, as long as you are meeting your macronutritent requirements you have set up for yourself. Also remember on non training days, do not have a post workout drink. The simple carbs are not necessary when you have not trained/cardio.

Hope that helps

Rick

natron is right on track with his comments too!

Lunch would be fine for a preworkout meal just as long as you give yourself enough time to let the food digest. I require 60-90 minutes as my workouts are pretty intense at times.

I have my protein shake after working out and a meal 1.5-2 hours later before I go to bed.

If i'm workin out in the mid-afternoon, I'd have a whole food meal 1.5-2 hours after my protein shake and then get back to my normal daily routine. (eating 3 hours later)

Ideally, eat your lunch....train 60-90 minutes later.....have a meal immediately postworkout (whole or shake) and have your next meal 90-120 minutes after that. Everything else beyond that is splitting hairs even further. It's not that difficult once you get into a routine.

I suggest reading "7 Habits of Highly Effective People". It's a good book that will motivate you to make some productive habits and help you break the old ones we so easily fall into.

It takes 21 days to make and break a habit.....keep that in mind.

- Fletch