Interested, The Turk 20% would have to be in 30g intervals instead of 50 like before. Price went up slightly unfortunetly. Banaba extract at 10% still deciding.

Haven't looked into the turk but I guess I should.

I am presently interested in the banaba.

That is a fairly high extract of banaba.

what about banaba caps alittle goes along way. i had good results with turk so you could put me down. what is up with 99% ecdy?

more for me than anyone else.... I for one didn't have a clue wtf turk did..

Mechanism of the anabolic action of phytoecdisteroids in mammals][Article in Russian]


Syrov VN.
In experiments with white mice it has been established that phytoecdisteroides turkesteron, ecdisteron and 2-desoxy-alpha-ecdison in the dose of 5 mg on 1 kg of body mass stimulate the protein synthesis. Using the model of protein synthesis from mice liver it has been shown that the action of phytoecdisteroides is connected with the rise of poliribosome functional activity and rate increase of protein macromolecules formation. Preliminary administration of actinomycin D does not prevent the effect of protein synthesis stimulation. It has been concluded that the anabolic effect of phytoecdisteroides in mammals organism is connected not with induction of RNA synthesis but with the acceleration of translocation processes.

PMID: 6525371 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Turk Info: http://www.insectscience.org/3.6/Dinan_et....IS_3_6_2003.pdf

The 99% ecdy aint as desired as expected.

well that study is bunk sir. Ecdysteroid resceptors don't exist in human. They're in insects. They LOOSEY base the possibility of it having SOME effect (which they don't explain what this might be) only because it has 11 alpha hydroxyl group attached. The problem here is that there is absolutely no reason to assume this shit does anything.

OK, just presenting what is know about this which is minimal. Heres another one: http://www.eje.cz/pdfarticles/337/eje_094_2_161_Spindler.pdf

study was done on cells from a chironomus tentans


from wiki:



I realize your just trying to announce the availability of a supplement. I am just trying to spark conversation about that supplement.

That's a helluva banaba extract. I would give it a definite HELL YEAH.

Just did a search for more info on banaba, I'm not too familiar with it. I don't see much here, or at least none of the thread titles are jumping out as obvious places to find the answer. Anyone have any links/info to share?

Hey Jinx, search for this: Lagerstroemia speciosa. This should bring some info on it.

first study on pubmed is the most relevant.

Effect of corosolic acid on gluconeogenesis in rat liver.Yamada K, Hosokawa M, Fujimoto S, Fujiwara H, Fujita Y, Harada N, Yamada C, Fukushima M, Ueda N, Kaneko T, Matsuyama F, Yamada Y, Seino Y, Inagaki N.
Department of Diabetes and Clinical Nutrition, Graduate School of Medicine, Kyoto University, 54 Shogoin, Kawahara-cho, Sakyo-ku, Kyoto 606-8507, Japan; Use Techno Corporation Co. Ltd., Kyoto, Japan.

Corosolic acid (CRA), an active component of Banaba leaves (Lagerstroemia speciosa L.), decreases blood glucose in diabetic animals and humans. In this study, we investigated the mechanism of action of CRA on gluconeogenesis in rat liver. CRA (20-100muM) dose-dependently decreased gluconeogenesis in perfused liver and in isolated hepatocytes. Fructose-2,6-bisphosphate (F-2,6-BP), a gluconeogenic intermediate, plays a critical role in hepatic glucose output by regulating gluconeogenesis and glycolysis in the liver. CRA increased the production of F-2,6-BP along with a decrease in intracellular levels of cAMP both in the presence and in the absence of forskolin in isolated hepatocytes. While a cAMP-dependent protein kinase (PKA) inhibitor inhibited hepatic gluconeogenesis, the drug did not intensify the inhibitory effect of CRA on hepatic gluconeogenesis in isolated hepatocytes. These results indicate that CRA inhibits gluconeogenesis by increasing the production of F-2,6-BP by lowering the cAMP level and inhibiting PKA activity in isolated hepatocytes. Furthermore, CRA increased glucokinase activity in isolated hepatocytes without affecting glucose-6-phosphatase activity, suggesting the promotion of glycolysis. These effects on hepatic glucose metabolism may underlie the various anti-diabetic actions of CRA.

PMID: 18177973 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]

I couldn't find any human studies. This goes back to the question of metabolism in rats vs. humans. Which has been debated to increasing degree around here.

this is form oxford and is more relevant:

The leaves of Lagerstroemia speciosa (Lythraceae), a Southeast Asian tree more commonly known as banaba, have been traditionally consumed in various forms by Philippinos for treatment of diabetes and kidney related diseases. In the 1990s, the popularity of this herbal medicine began to attract the attention of scientists worldwide. Since then, researchers have conducted numerous in vitro and in vivo studies that consistently confirmed the antidiabetic activity of banaba. Scientists have identified different components of banaba to be responsible for its activity. Using tumor cells as a cell model, corosolic acid was isolated from the methanol extract of banaba and shown to be an active compound. More recently, a different cell model and the focus on the water soluble fraction of the extract led to the discovery of other compounds. The ellagitannin Lagerstroemin was identified as an effective component of the banaba extract responsible for the activity. In a different approach, using 3T3-L1 adipocytes as a cell model and a glucose uptake assay as the functional screening method, Chen et al. showed that the banaba water extract exhibited an insulin-like glucose transport inducing activity. Coupling HPLC fractionation with a glucose uptake assay, gallotannins were identified in the banaba extract as components responsible for the activity, not corosolic acid. Penta-O-galloyl-glucopyranose (PGG) was identified as the most potent gallotannin. A comparison of published data with results obtained for PGG indicates that PGG has a significantly higher glucose transport stimulatory activity than Lagerstroemin. Chen et al. have also shown that PGG exhibits anti-adipogenic properties in addition to stimulating the glucose uptake in adipocytes. The combination of glucose uptake and anti-adipogenesis activity is not found in the current insulin mimetic drugs and may indicate a great therapeutic potential of PGG.


the full study can be found here:

http://ecam.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/nem013v1

they give a history of discoveries, but all seem to be based on mice/rat studies. Seems like something to experiment with especially if your doing CKD. Getting back into keto could be very easy if it does the same in humans as in rats.

I wouldn't expect turk/ecdy/euphol to have any degree of affinity for the AR, based on structure alone. Again, the interesting point is the "tripartite synergism between sex steroid receptors, sex hormones and plant-derived lipids" showing action past the point of saturation at the AR.