I had a bit of an epiphany the other nite when I was looking my gf over, she has the most stubborn fat Ive ever encountered on her lower abs and hips. No that's not the epiphany either, its been there for some time. She's very lean everywhere else, diet is perfect, exercise is perfect, but I can't get these last 2 pounds to budge. Frustrating as hell for her and me as well, I should be able to advice something that works...

Anyhow, I was feeling her fat on her lower stomach and it was extremely hard in juxtaposition to my own. I got to thinking about VAT Vs SAT, and my own stubborn lower abdominal fat which is rather soft and easy enough to get rid of when I try. Is this the visceral fat I've heard about? I've had her try Clen, Sesathin, EC and a low dose shorter cycle of T3, the latter is the only one that may have worked for her. Is a topical like Absolved needed here? If my memory is correct here, that was the one that was used for VAT I believe.

I'm just bouncin ideas around here, as I really am rather stumped at this point. I know everyone is going to scream diet and exercise are the culprit, but I can assure you without the tedium of details required to prove it, her eating and exercise is in order. Any supplement suggestions are welcome, she's pretty open to trying new things God, I even know she reads this forum lol

Visceral fat is intra-abdominal, you should'nt be able to feel it...except maybe hard abdominals stretched over it. If it is deposited over the abdominals it is sub-q, regardless of the consistancy.

lean extreme FTW

Try this:
weeks 1,2
clen slowly ramp up on dosage over the two weeks
weeks 3,4
ephedrine, caffeine, yohimbine three times daily
weeks 5,6
clen slowly ramp up on dosage over the two weeks
weeks 7,8
ephedrine, caffeine, yohimbine three times daily
weeks 1-8
Run fish oil, sesamin, GTE, and high doses of CLA

The problem with all those supps is they didn't work... Im not stacking all those up to lose 2 pounds that should have come off already. If it were me I'd have them gone in 3 weeks tops. I think Ill try some kinda of topical and cort blocker next, seems a good pairing to me

I would go with Napalm. It should take care of that little bit of fat whether it's SAT or VAT.

The problem is that clen already blunts cortisol. I have used both clen and Lean Extreme. Based on my experience, I would say clen has a greater anti-catabolic effect.
If she is down to those last quarter inches it is more likely sub-q fat than vat fat which is being a "visual disturbance." I had a girlfriend who was a rugby player, she was muscular and in great shape but carried a high amount of vat fat. It wasnt apparrent in one problem area, it gave an overall thicker appearance to the gut.

Yeah, give Napalm a whirl. Par said it should act like a combo of Lipoderm and Ab-Solved.

I guess I had VAT all wrong, high epiphanies only go so far.... It's most definitely SAT then. I think the loosening up of the fat is what means its ready to go? Mine is almost always rather loose and ready, my appetite on the other hand is a whole other bitch

I had considered Napalm a while back, and I think she even had taken a look at the write up. The only thing now is whether it will stain clothing or not, she has said that is the only thing standing in the way of a TD.

I've never noticed any staining of clothes, nor have I heard any others report it.

Weird, she said she read it in product reviews, probably on NP or sumthin. Out of all the TD's I've run I've never had that problem either.

I thought VAT was what give you that hard distended belly? (Fat around/amongst the organs?)

Should tactics for removing it be any different than standard diet/cardio?

Nope, no staining with Napalm.

You were correct in your thoughts.

Yes, that is correct. Standard diet/cardio should work fine. Stimulants won't.

VAT is associated with insulin resistance, cortisol, plasma norepinephrine and androgens.

Sometimes it just sucks being female. I believe that we are genetically modeled to carry extra fat around our abdomen as a protective layer for child bearing.

I know its natural, but she now has pants that dont fit(Dun Dun DUnnnnnn). How that plays into me caring.... I guess as one perfectionist to another I can appreciate the struggle

Napalm FTW! It doesn't stain.

As long as she doesn't rub the Napalm on her clothes, it shouldn't stain

Thanks.

I have picked up some Napalm recently you think this will help?

Why do stims not help in this situation?


No staining from Napalm btw, dries quickly, good product.

Reference to Napalm and VAT here:

http://www.mindandmuscle.net/forum/index.p...st&p=444016

Simply stated, stims increase stress, and VAT is correlated with increased stress.

If the stomach is hard and she is lean otherwise I think it is more likely that she has tight hip flexors and lordosis.

Look at the pictures , lean but lower stomach bulge out ?

http://www.google.se/search?hl=sv&q=lordosis&meta=

The whole VAT thing seems overblown compared to posture/lordosis.

Of course it sells supplements...

I think you quoted the wrong guy or something...I just said "Napalm FTW (For the Win!)..."

Wow, I think you hit the nail on th head with this one, it certainly resembles her posture. She also has a sagging, or riding high, depending on how you view it, trapezius on one side. She is always complaining about it as it is rather apparant when she is lifting, could this somehow tie in? Is Lordosis something she should see a doc about?

Hit up Marc about some things you can do to correct hyperlordosis. In general though:

1. Stretch the hip flexors and quads aggressively
2. Strengthen the rectus abdominus
3. Strengthen the gluteals (and insure she's properly firing them as opposed to using her lower back)

Kimbo is on the money.

Check out Neandertahl no more (not sure if this link is allowed?) :

http://www.t-nation.com/readArticle.do?id=459379

That´s part one out of four. All very useful.

I feel like a complete newb as over here trying to read that article. Would tightness in the hip flexors and the like inhbit proper posture while Squating? She has it down, however can not for the life of her get to parallel, with or without weight. The weight is up to 100 pounds now for 12 reps, and she has perfect form until she is 3/4 of the way down to parallel. Any further and she will fall or something, I can't really help at that point.

On a diet related note, all of our carb cycling articles seem rather dated, and its something she has expressed interest in. Anyone have any good links for that while I'm being a mooch? I promise at some point I'll have her posting with pics, so it will totally be worth it

i'd like to see them to see if it's real lordosis.. Women don't lean out like men. Dieting to that next step usually with women requires some extreme measures. I mean diet wise. Not all the ridiculous fat loss aids you've given her

Any chance you can take a profile pic of her for us?

Well, tight hip flexors can cause all sorts of other problems - it's kind of a chain reaction. If she can't get all the way down, she needs to lower the weight until her flexibility improves. Nail that down first and fix her imbalances if there are indeed any. Ankle flexibility is also important when squatting.

Over-pronation for one. This link http://www.peakrunningperformance.com/free.../free_issue.pdf has article about fixing pelvic tilt by correcting strength and flexibility imbalances. Geared towards the running crowd, but same principles apply to weight lifters.

Don't forget this one...

Actually sent her that one Marc, and I'll have to see about some pics for the rest of y'all. So far as lowering the weight goes, we started REALLY low a few months back, she just never could get that low. I thought increasing form and adding weight might help, so the other day I tried to get her low, and it still wasn't happening. ON the flip side, her SLDL's are improving greatly

What things are best for attacking SAT?

The Napalm beta I tested stained the shit out of my white sheets. Completely ruined them actually.