I'm in the market for some new shoes that I hope will help improve my squat strength and form. I'm currently transitioning from some everyday Adidas running shoes that are falling apart and were never a good choice to begin with. Based on some quick research, it seems that optimal shoe choice is a function of how the squat is performed - olympic vs powerlifting. Additionally, it seems that the two shoe types are at complete opposite ends of the design spectrum.

At first blush, I would have thought that a flat soled shoe with minimal compressibility would be great for squats. This thought was validated when I came to see the infamous Chuck Taylor All-Star recommended by many folks. Another shoe recommended was the "Metal" brand squat shoe. A few times, though, someone would recommend shoes specifically designed for olympic lifting, which have hard wedges in the heel. This design was also mentioned in passing by my physical therapist today. Adidas makes a few of these.

My squat is more along the lines of olympic style, so should I pursue a raised-heel design? My current problem appears to be tightness in my lats, which is limiting my ability to keep my chest up and maintain the arch in my back at the bottom of the squat motion. I end up tilding forward ever so slightly, but enough to give me some disk problems at L5S1.

Thoughts?

I have always been a fan of Adidas Sambas...flat, minimal compression, good grip. I've worn them to lift in for years. My kids talked me into a pair of Vans the last time I bought sneakers and they seem to work just fine too although my next pair will be Sambas.

That said, once upon a time I was known to squat wearing logger boots...

I was considering Sambas, but they seem to be more along the lines of flat-soled, which people are saying is better for wider stance, less deep squats. I squat with feet around shoulder width, possibly a little more narrow, and a few inches below parallel.

If I squat with my heels elevated it kills my knees. I have a pair of Puma's (suede I might add) I keep in my gym bag just for squatting. For everything else I'll usually rock some Nikes. Puma cats (the shoe) have almost no heel elevation and are hard as can be. Not good for jogging, but very stylish :-)

Puma's


Edit: I go ATG every time, but I do have a rather wide stance 3-4 inches outside shoulders.

For what it's worth, I deadlift barefoot, but when I tried this approach for squats I felt terribly unstable. It felt like having my heel so low reduced my flexibility considerably, and I had a very difficult time not leaning forward.

anybody tried nike free's?

I have Adidas weightlifting shoes (the red Ironworks?). I'm tall and not built for squatting, and these shoes have made squatting much deeper and much more fun. I've always had cranky knees but have never experienced any discomfort in these shoes.

They're not cheap, but I'd imagine they last quite a while. I wouldn't do anything but squat and oly lift in them, though.

What's the difference between powerlifting and olympic squats then? The width of the feet? Don't both avenues simply say, oh that's a wide stance squat or something? Is the real wide olympic squat because of the larger amount of weight or something? I try to do both kinds really, sometimes in the same day, just to keep from getting stuck.

I like sambas a lot. But like you said, Kimbo you're looking for something that has wedges in the heel, no? So that's like raising you up from your heel right? Weirdness. And if your problem is tightness in your lats then how is buying a shoe to compensate for that a solid game plan?

If you squat in a more upright position like the olympic squat, the olympic shoes would be fine. I usually wear some sambas when squatting but if I'm going higher rep and closer stance I'll usually wear my olympic lifting shoes. That's mainly just for working on my ROM though. I do always use them when front squatting though. Oh, my natural squat stance is pretty middle of the road; probably right at shoulder width, maybe a tad wider.

Regarding nike free's: I didn't like squatting in them at all. Made the weights feel heavier than typical and I felt very unstable, comparatively. They are nice for plyos and sprint work though.

Width of the feet differs, but it's also a bunch of other things. Here are the differences, in general:

PL squat: wide stance, sit back, shins vertical, more forward lean, low bar position (lower traps/rear delts), stop at parallel
OL squat: shoulder width stance, sit down, shins not vertical (knees travel over toes), more upright, high bar position (on top of traps), stop when your ass hits your heels

They're very different lifts. And what confuses people a lot of the time is that they'll get squatting advice from both camps, so their squats ends up as some sort of mix of the two, which just does not work.



You meant GFK, right? The wedge in the heel causes your upper body to stay more upright, which is important for Oly lifting (forward lean during a snatch or clean is bad news). The heel would help compensate for forward lean, but not so much if there's lat tightness.

In general, the type of shoe you want for Oly squats are Oly lifting shoes. The heel is hard so it provides support, and it's raised so that it keeps you more upright. For PL, you want something that provides ankle support (since your shins are going to be vertical) and are relatively flat (transfers more work to the posterior chain). I squatted in OL shoes when I did PL, though, and it worked fine for me, but I've also used Chucks and they're good too. Rickey Dale Crain makes some PL squat shoes that are supposed to be phenomenal, although extremely ugly.

My problem manifests itself as my chest dropping slightly and my shoulders drifting forward during the bottom few inches of the lift. As Kimbo said, I'm hoping that shoes with a bit of a wedge in the heel would help to keep my body more upright through the lift. I also have some hamstring and glute tightness that pull my pelvis forward near the bottom of the lift as well, so the problem is happening a bit on both ends. Obviously, a fair amount of stretching and massage work is also in order.

I'm using a pair of walking shoes. Flat sole, high top (sort of) that is a bit too bulky for comfortable running or agility training. But for squatting they are very good. I think they have a mild forward slope but it is hard to tell.

Not to sure how important foot arch is for squatting but a friend of mine uses Adidas because some of their shoes have a metal arch formed into them.

what are your training goals?

Both strength and hypertrophy. No intentions of competing in powerlifting competitions, but I find my legs respond very well to stuff in the 4-6 rep range. My glute and ham development is a bit better than my quad development, so I'd like to fill out the front of my legs a bit more, particularly the outer quad.

FWIW, if you're a cheap ass, you can substitute bowling shoes for Oly shoes. The heel can be replaced with a wooden wedge if you need more heel. Real Oly shoes can be somewhat pricey.

I've got no problem dropping $150-$200 on a great pair of Adidas Ironworks or Adistars, as they'll probably last me for years. I am having difficulty finding a place online that sells these things, other than some obscure sounding mom-and-pop store in Washington State.

FWIW, I got a pair of Do Wins off of Glenn Pendley's site a little bit ago and have no complaints with them. I've never tried any of Adidas to give a comparison though.

http://store.wfwclub.com/index.html

In that case I'd go barefoot or socks if your gym allows it, if not, nike free 5.0/4.0 if you can find them or any low flat sole snicker.

Olympic shoes are for oly lifters who are extremely flexible and activate the posterior chain with elevated heels. you, are not.

Same here.

but i guess if you want heals that go up then sambas would not be choice.

i like sambas a ton, just in general. They have a great arch in them which is rare to find in any shoe these days let alone on that is so flat otherwise.

Are you saying that you have to be flexible in order to use Oly shoes? Because this isn't the case. Oly shoes allow you to go deep while staying more upright. They should also shift more work over to the quads vs. the posterior chain due to being more upright - the posterior chain will still do a lot of work, but that's because you're using a full ROM, not because of the Oly shoes.

Well if you want to go barefoot and can't due to gym policy. Grappling shoes would probably be the best choice, very flexible, little sole, and no lift.

yes, I know. please re-read my post.

scope

intended reading: Olympic shoes are [for oly lifters who are extremely flexible and activate the posterior chain with elevated heels]. you, are not.

understood reading: Olympic shoes are [for oly lifters who are extremely flexible] and [activate the posterior chain with elevated heels]. you, are not.

The best thing I can think to do here would be to waltz into a sporting goods store, try on a pair, and go through a few body weight squats. It would be even better if the place had a squat rack where I could run through a few quick reps at 225, but I'm not holding out hope. I'm thinking I'll be lucky to even find a physical store that offers oly shoes, and will probably have to just order a pair from a virtual store and hope for the best.

If I knew the geometry and materials of an oly shoe sole, I think I could mock up something to at least give me a feel for how a pair might act.

Makes more sense. Thanks.